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Old 08-24-2021, 08:08 PM   #61161
Emperor Smeat
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lock Jaw View Post
AEW would be wise to NOT sign Adam Cole. They already have too many people, he isn't that good anyways, and would probably be even worse given creative freedom.
Staying in WWE would be even worse since regardless of him staying in NXT or getting called up, his future doesn't really bode well there.

Staying in NXT does him no good in terms of career direction since he has been just spinning his wheels there for the past 3 years or so while making way less than main roster money.

Getting called up to the main roster would be a big boost to his pay since he'd be going from around $130k per year to around $400k per year if Riddle recent call-up deal is any indication. The big tradeoff is the chances of him having any real lasting success on the main roster is really bleak due to his small size and WWE's mostly awful track record with call-ups from the men's side of NXT.

If he were to go to AEW, Fightful recently teased a modern day Radicalz-like effect or group AEW will be getting with all the guys coming in to the company. Punk as the start of it and Cole as one of those potential guys. Plus his wrestling style would fit better in AEW than WWE's main roster.
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Old 08-24-2021, 10:58 PM   #61162
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I would prefer to not see Adam Cole in either WWE or AEW
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Old 08-24-2021, 11:38 PM   #61163
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Yeah, would rather just not see Adam Cole.
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Old 08-24-2021, 11:47 PM   #61164
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Minoru Suzuki vs Homicide announced for GCW in September. Yes please.
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Old 08-24-2021, 11:47 PM   #61165
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holy shit
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Old 08-25-2021, 12:05 AM   #61166
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Hopefully Suzuki finds some spare time during his trip to America to squeeze in a beating to Orange Cassidy.

That was originally promised for last year before COVID decided to wreck havoc on everything.
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Old 08-25-2021, 12:25 AM   #61167
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slik View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slik View Post
They'll lose some of the current NXT fanbase but might get some new eyeballs in return. Sounds like they want more Omos types and less AJ Styles types.
Guess I'll be taking drave's advice...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Guycott View Post
The biggest problem there, though, is that WWE themselves created this problem to begin with by codifying this. Trying to populate the entire roster with bodybuilders and swimsuit magazine models with a tertiary emphasis on getting them to work well in the ring or on the mic (or both) is a stupid way to approach the endeavor, coupled with consistently telling people through words and deeds that anyone they consider "small" is worthless (and even that is relative - some of the guys who are considered GOAT historically aren't really people who strictly pass that eye test).

Then, they'll do shit like have a guy the size of Braun Strowman and try to make him work like he's Ricochet. Or not realize the reason why there was so much groaning and eye rolling at the rehire of Eva Marie was because nearly every match she had, she nearly Droz'd her opponent, herself, or both, but she was getting fast tracked to rule the Divas Division because she's "pretty" and was a bitch on an auxillary reality show that most wrestling fans weren't watching and that was supposed to be a 1:1 translation on her being the hottest female heel WWE had ever seen. It didn't.

Instead of looking at the issue of start-stop pushes and not properly building or presenting guys (colloquial - men and women) in ways that will eventually work them up the card, they do shit like bank all their money on a handful of talent (look how long it took for them to finally get Roman in the position they wanted him in from day one) and let everyone else languish. They script bullshit and write dumbass tripe angles and sometimes try super hard with the shittiest gimmicks possible neverminding what it might do detrimentally to th
folks on the roster saddled with this shit. They panic and call people back who were over 10 years plus ago; often at the detriment of people they could be focusing on now. And if anyone outside of their pet projects fail, it's their own fault for not being backed by the machine that quite honestly likely promised them the moon and then cuts them a month later.

But no... they failed because they're not 6'6 and 285lbs of weightlifter muscle. If only they willed themselves to grow taller, they might make it in the business.

There was more to this, but I don't have time to write it now, and I know I'm going to lose the tangent I was on if I try to come back to it later. Point is, there's too much stock put into this "midgets" mentality or the "needs to look like a star walking through the airport"... and by "star" they actually mean giant and jacked up. If the machine got behind some of these folks like they got behind others, there's no way the world wouldn't know who Shinsuke Nakamura was at this point if they treated him more like a guy who has the intangible charisma he has and less like generic foreign guy #582. There are plenty of others who could have been or currently be stars if the company would allow them to be stars instead of stunting them because THEY don't believe they are stars.
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Old 08-25-2021, 12:46 AM   #61168
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Damian Rey 2.0 View Post
Man I remember when asuka was a fucking wrecking machine
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skeletor View Post
Asuka is someone they rely on when they don't have the golden girls. Asuka is over and a fucking machine. It sucks to see what they've done to her on the main roster...even with her success.
Quote:
Originally Posted by drave View Post
Let's talk about Bianca Belair and how she'll be irrelevant within 6 months. Shameful how they did what they did.
This is another one of those bad habits WWE has instilled to their own fans. Asuka was killing bitches in NXT. She was beating two jobbers in handicap matches with cocky heel swagger. She was running circles around the nearly the whole female roster. She had a Goldberg run. Commentary was talking her up as this tough badass and the "most feared striker in women's wrestling" which got corrected to "In ALL of pro-wrestling" consistently, and she was delivering those goods.

Then, on the main roster call up debut, she had a competitive match that she barely won with a girl they already treated like comedic jobber trash for forever and obviously already planned to release that week. On her big stage debut, they just told their own main audience that Asuka wasn't that good by their own booking. "Perception is reality, pal!"

I don't understand Bianca. She is someone TAILOR MADE for WWE. She's tall (for women), super athletic, muscular enough, can talk, has charisma for days, and has picked up this shit super quick from 100% from scratch green when the WWE got a hold of her... how do you fuck up your own homegrown gift?!?

I know it's kind of a bad example to point to considering "dumbing himself out of position", but I can never not think of Patrick Clark's "Call Me Up, Vince" tights... because before he fucked up his own career trajectory he clawed his way up to being white hot, that still remains a microcosm of the fear that for as big of a star it looked like he was guaranteed to be. I pretty much had this pang of worry that he would have his advice taken and, to paraphrase Samoa Joe, "trip over some bad booking".

I almost want to make some sort of a meme of that Takeover entrance, but paste [random relevant wrestler] face over VD of someone who was called up and subsequently mishandled and/or fucked over.
Last edited by Tom Guycott; 08-25-2021 at 01:01 AM.
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Old 08-25-2021, 12:50 AM   #61169
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emperor Smeat View Post
Hopefully Suzuki finds some spare time during his trip to America to squeeze in a beating to [insert AEW name here].
You know Tony would spring for the song rights for another chance to mention "The Forbidden Door", and that audience would at least be familiar enough with his entrance to do it right, so that would be icing on the King killing spree cake. Also, one step closer to all of Suzuki-Gun being stateside.
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Old 08-25-2021, 01:00 AM   #61170
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emperor Smeat View Post
Staying in WWE would be even worse since regardless of him staying in NXT or getting called up, his future doesn't really bode well there.

Staying in NXT does him no good in terms of career direction since he has been just spinning his wheels there for the past 3 years or so while making way less than main roster money.

Getting called up to the main roster would be a big boost to his pay since he'd be going from around $130k per year to around $400k per year if Riddle recent call-up deal is any indication. The big tradeoff is the chances of him having any real lasting success on the main roster is really bleak due to his small size and WWE's mostly awful track record with call-ups from the men's side of NXT.

If he were to go to AEW, Fightful recently teased a modern day Radicalz-like effect or group AEW will be getting with all the guys coming in to the company. Punk as the start of it and Cole as one of those potential guys. Plus his wrestling style would fit better in AEW than WWE's main roster.
Quote:
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I would prefer to not see Adam Cole in either WWE or AEW
Honestly, he's someone I'd prefer to slide to NWA. Someone with some hype behind them should really dethrone Aldis sometime soon and get some attention back to that product, and I think Cole could work as NWA Champion in the same way I though Ziggler could have a number of years back (before he re-upped his contract with that alleged "I get to fuck off and do my comedy gigs whenever I want" clause"). I honestly think Danielson would have been the PERFECT fit for that role, but I think Cole could get it accomplished. Plus, it would be the road less traveled, since everyone is treating this as a two-and-a-half dog race between WWE and AEW, and "*maybe* New Japan but travel restrictions could be an issue".
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Old 08-25-2021, 03:27 AM   #61171
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Saw a clip nxt and good God is Kyle O’Reily awful on the mic. I mean just all time bad. Idk maybe he’s supposed to a weird awkward dork, but it wasn’t endearing or funny was just awkward and dumb.
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Old 08-25-2021, 07:50 AM   #61172
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Damian Rey 2.0 View Post
Saw a clip nxt and good God is Kyle O’Reily awful on the mic. I mean just all time bad. Idk maybe he’s supposed to a weird awkward dork, but it wasn’t endearing or funny was just awkward and dumb.
Everybody's gotta start somewhere. I still remember that Roman Reigns "I'm the man" speech from his NXT appearance, and that sucked copious ass. To be portraying himself as this heir-apparent confident badass, he seemed really insecure and cringy. Fast foward, and look at him now... worlds better with reps and time. Kyle is already at least better than that one. Nowhere to go but up.
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Old 08-25-2021, 09:33 AM   #61173
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Guycott View Post
This is another one of those bad habits WWE has instilled to their own fans. Asuka was killing bitches in NXT. She was beating two jobbers in handicap matches with cocky heel swagger. She was running circles around the nearly the whole female roster. She had a Goldberg run. Commentary was talking her up as this tough badass and the "most feared striker in women's wrestling" which got corrected to "In ALL of pro-wrestling" consistently, and she was delivering those goods.

Then, on the main roster call up debut, she had a competitive match that she barely won with a girl they already treated like comedic jobber trash for forever and obviously already planned to release that week. On her big stage debut, they just told their own main audience that Asuka wasn't that good by their own booking. "Perception is reality, pal!"

I don't understand Bianca. She is someone TAILOR MADE for WWE. She's tall (for women), super athletic, muscular enough, can talk, has charisma for days, and has picked up this shit super quick from 100% from scratch green when the WWE got a hold of her... how do you fuck up your own homegrown gift?!?

I know it's kind of a bad example to point to considering "dumbing himself out of position", but I can never not think of Patrick Clark's "Call Me Up, Vince" tights... because before he fucked up his own career trajectory he clawed his way up to being white hot, that still remains a microcosm of the fear that for as big of a star it looked like he was guaranteed to be. I pretty much had this pang of worry that he would have his advice taken and, to paraphrase Samoa Joe, "trip over some bad booking".

I almost want to make some sort of a meme of that Takeover entrance, but paste [random relevant wrestler] face over VD of someone who was called up and subsequently mishandled and/or fucked over.



This was spurred from a convo elsewhere and me stating that Belair was a "placeholder champ", as they had no one else at the time who really fit the role.


She had "the machine" behind her for a few months, but that's it. Given what they just did to her, she will be all but forgotten about in 6 months or less.
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Old 08-25-2021, 09:38 AM   #61174
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On a super positive note:




ITS WEDNESDAY NIGHT, YOU KNOW WHAT THAT MEANS!!!!!!!
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Old 08-25-2021, 09:47 AM   #61175
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in regards to Bianca I am still wondering if maybe there was more going on behind the scenes with her and Banks or something and maybe Bianca getting squashed is punishment for something.
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Old 08-25-2021, 10:18 AM   #61176
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Doesn't matter, clock's ticking
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Old 08-25-2021, 11:20 AM   #61177
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Everybody's gotta start somewhere. I still remember that Roman Reigns "I'm the man" speech from his NXT appearance, and that sucked copious ass. To be portraying himself as this heir-apparent confident badass, he seemed really insecure and cringy. Fast foward, and look at him now... worlds better with reps and time. Kyle is already at least better than that one. Nowhere to go but up.
Start? Kyle O'Reilly has been wrestling since 2005. If he hasn't figured it out by now, he never will.
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Old 08-25-2021, 11:23 AM   #61178
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Instantly think of Kyle O'Reilly and Aleister Black on NXT.


It was my mother-in-law's first time seeing Aleister Black, and I had never heard of Kyle. Told her that Black was going to beat the shit outta this "jobber" and then was given one of the best, stiffest matches in NXT I've ever watched.


Never heard the dude talk, don't care. He kicks, he kicks hard.
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Old 08-25-2021, 11:35 AM   #61179
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No more small boring dudes who can't talk.
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Old 08-25-2021, 01:09 PM   #61180
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Originally Posted by drave View Post
Instantly think of Kyle O'Reilly and Aleister Black on NXT.


It was my mother-in-law's first time seeing Aleister Black, and I had never heard of Kyle. Told her that Black was going to beat the shit outta this "jobber" and then was given one of the best, stiffest matches in NXT I've ever watched.


Never heard the dude talk, don't care. He kicks, he kicks hard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Gertner of TPWW View Post
No more small boring dudes who can't talk.
Yeah, Kyle O'Reilly can work, and I enjoy watching him do so, but I don't care to see him in anything above IC level.
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Old 08-25-2021, 02:18 PM   #61181
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What even was Adam Cole's draw? In no way being a dick, but he is comically small to be taken with any seriousness whatsoever.


Maybe if I see him outside of WWE?? I dunno man. Feel like he should fight Marko Stunt in a "participants leave wrestling forever" match.
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Old 08-25-2021, 02:21 PM   #61182
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He's a good rassler
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Old 08-25-2021, 02:31 PM   #61183
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What even was Adam Cole's draw? In no way being a dick, but he is comically small to be taken with any seriousness whatsoever.
He would say BAY BAY after yelling his own name
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Old 08-25-2021, 03:05 PM   #61184
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Sounds like a vanilla midget
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Old 08-25-2021, 03:58 PM   #61185
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What even was Adam Cole's draw? In no way being a dick, but he is comically small to be taken with any seriousness whatsoever.


Maybe if I see him outside of WWE?? I dunno man. Feel like he should fight Marko Stunt in a "participants leave wrestling forever" match.
I tend to agree with you here. His small body does look comical next to his HBKesque head and face. The thing about him is that he was a protege of HBK for the past few years and he is very talented in the ring and with promo's. I think he'd be a good guy to help better some of the AEW guys who haven't had that WWE experience.

I think his product can overcome his presentation.
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Old 08-25-2021, 04:24 PM   #61186
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I dunno man. People don't have to be absolutely jacked or anything, but he is just..... beyond small. Like, I wouldn't even buy him shoulder checking Spike Dudley.
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Old 08-25-2021, 04:51 PM   #61187
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drave View Post
What even was Adam Cole's draw? In no way being a dick, but he is comically small to be taken with any seriousness whatsoever.


Maybe if I see him outside of WWE?? I dunno man. Feel like he should fight Marko Stunt in a "participants leave wrestling forever" match.
Pretty much his athleticism and being a great fit as the cocky leader of a dominate group.

If you took away all of his athleticism, he still has pretty good to great promo skills compared to most in NXT and WWE and probably would be closer to The Miz for comparisons as a draw.

Swap him with anyone else in Undisputed Era as its leader and the group likely doesn't reach the same level of big success it did in NXT.

In terms of actual star power draw, that's a bit hard to say since he's never had any real main roster run to see what his true potential could be in WWE and would have to fight against WWE's view for years that nobody can be bigger than the brand.
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Old 08-25-2021, 05:47 PM   #61188
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I dunno man. People don't have to be absolutely jacked or anything, but he is just..... beyond small. Like, I wouldn't even buy him shoulder checking Spike Dudley.
This is my sentiment. I might feel differently if he was shredded like Baylor.
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Old 08-25-2021, 07:36 PM   #61189
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Old 08-25-2021, 09:50 PM   #61190
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Saw a clip nxt and good God is Kyle O’Reily awful on the mic. I mean just all time bad. Idk maybe he’s supposed to a weird awkward dork, but it wasn’t endearing or funny was just awkward and dumb.
O'Reily is awful on the mic, and he spoke right after one of the most charismatic guys on NXT, making it all the more obvious how bad he is.
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Old 08-26-2021, 12:42 AM   #61191
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This was spurred from a convo elsewhere and me stating that Belair was a "placeholder champ", as they had no one else at the time who really fit the role.


She had "the machine" behind her for a few months, but that's it. Given what they just did to her, she will be all but forgotten about in 6 months or less.
But really, what's a few months? It smacks of "Vince is bored with this now" and, once again, feeds into the problem of their own invention where they have forgotten how to build stars for the future. If you tell people through words and deeds that X is not worth watching, why would people care to watch? The women's division(s) can't be "All Charlotte all the time", and there's only so long Becky can last until they wring her completely dry from overexposure.

Beating the drum on the women right now, but pretty much anything can be swapped out here. Tag teams. Cruiserweights. Perpetual midcard talent. Fresh new NXT call ups. Instead of leaving the audience with the impression that there is someone new waiting in the wings to be some sort of credible threat to being a future star, they just latch onto the hottest thing they back into (most of the time) and ride that wagon until the wheels come off.

Going back to a thing I said about Roman years back - them being so dead set on him being the literal face of the company through hell or high water (I even remember mentioning there was a goddamn PSA billboard with him on it a couple blocks from my house) - by now, he could have been a heel, had a redemption to be the babyface they wanted all along, had plenty of time to cash in on his popularity, and at this point, could have been using him to make other stars. But because they were being stubborn with him, they're still stuck on the heel step. And by the time they might get to a face turn, it'll either be too late, they won't have anyone else to push that is actually ready to step up from their own ineptitude, or he'll fuck off to Hollywood as they try to scramble to fill his shoes from the ground up again, only more instantaneously.

His type of support shouldn't be a rarity.
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Old 08-26-2021, 01:04 AM   #61192
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Quote:
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in regards to Bianca I am still wondering if maybe there was more going on behind the scenes with her and Banks or something and maybe Bianca getting squashed is punishment for something.
I wouldn't be surprised if it was some sort of pettiness over a proposed angle where she gets a boyfriend or some shit in spite of her marriage to Montez being fairly common knowledge. That is unfortunately yet another bed WWE has made themselves; the fact that *that* would be my first guess, and how high the probability is that I'm completely right with zero evidence.

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Originally Posted by Fignuts View Post
Start? Kyle O'Reilly has been wrestling since 2005. If he hasn't figured it out by now, he never will.
Again, not everyone is a natural on the stick. How long has Jeff Hardy been doing this shit? He was a literally underaged job guy right around the end of "The New Generation" days and the dawn of the Attitude Era, and he didn't really pick up a mic at all for about 15 years. And when he finally did, it was fucking abysmal. He clearly needed all the practice he eventually got. Think about how rotten a promo Corey Graves was as an active wrestler versus how he sounds now as a goddamn anouncer. Would you have ever thought he would even make it as an announcer? I don't think anyone here on TPWW, myself included, thought he'd be able to pull that off.

Kyle never had to be a mic savant, and my whole exposure with him began and ended with ReDragon. Anything I've seen of promos, I remember Fish doing the heavy lifting on the stick, which is prob'ly why he's always injured.

Again I say, reps and time. Kyle could possibly get there. Just needs practice. They've given TV time to worse.
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Old 08-26-2021, 02:16 AM   #61193
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It seems to be such an easy story to write. Becky comes back. Gets a title match at survivor series after running through some heels to build her up. Loses to Bianca in her big rematch. Had to win the tumble again and fight all the way back to mania, where Belair drops the belt after a year of beating everyone. Becky gets back to the spot she never lost, Bianca gets a year long reign, and there’s more money to be made between the two down the line in the rubber match and both come out looking great.

Instead they made Bianca look like a huge dork and apparently wanna turn Becky heel. Lmao how tone deaf is this company? The fans love Becky. They wanna cheer her. So Vince is gonna turn her heel. Lol.

I’ve seen the wwe faithful on Twitter saying to let the story play out and I think I saw a reference to Daniel Bryan losing in shirt order at mania as an example of why this could work. The difference being Brian was an obnoxious, annoying little shit of a heel who finally got what was coming to him, and it catapulted him into a face turn that eventually made him their most popular star. Last I checked, Bianca wasn’t being a chicken shit and primed for karma. 8 months flushed right down the shitter.
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Old 08-26-2021, 02:17 AM   #61194
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Quote:
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But really, what's a few months? It smacks of "Vince is bored with this now" and, once again, feeds into the problem of their own invention where they have forgotten how to build stars for the future. If you tell people through words and deeds that X is not worth watching, why would people care to watch? The women's division(s) can't be "All Charlotte all the time", and there's only so long Becky can last until they wring her completely dry from overexposure.

Beating the drum on the women right now, but pretty much anything can be swapped out here. Tag teams. Cruiserweights. Perpetual midcard talent. Fresh new NXT call ups. Instead of leaving the audience with the impression that there is someone new waiting in the wings to be some sort of credible threat to being a future star, they just latch onto the hottest thing they back into (most of the time) and ride that wagon until the wheels come off.

Going back to a thing I said about Roman years back - them being so dead set on him being the literal face of the company through hell or high water (I even remember mentioning there was a goddamn PSA billboard with him on it a couple blocks from my house) - by now, he could have been a heel, had a redemption to be the babyface they wanted all along, had plenty of time to cash in on his popularity, and at this point, could have been using him to make other stars. But because they were being stubborn with him, they're still stuck on the heel step. And by the time they might get to a face turn, it'll either be too late, they won't have anyone else to push that is actually ready to step up from their own ineptitude, or he'll fuck off to Hollywood as they try to scramble to fill his shoes from the ground up again, only more instantaneously.

His type of support shouldn't be a rarity.
Damn. This thread is it. I've been a fan of WWE for some almost 3 decades now, but I'm done with them (and have been for several years now) unless and until I know either Vince is dead or he's legit no longer in charge of creative in any capacity.

I only spend my time watching AEW, and it's certainly not perfect. You can make the argument that Tony, et al., are much like fans themselves, and/or cater to their fans. Perhaps that's even true a little too often in some cases. However, I'd rather watch the AEW product instead of a product created by someone who despises the majority of the audience or even the industry he's actually involved in, and treats viewers like they're legit stupid and/or are a hindrance to his creative plans.
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Old 08-26-2021, 08:01 AM   #61195
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Adam Cole has grown on me. The best thing about him as an acquisition is that they actually built around him in NXT, and he’s a good worker and talker. A good get objectively, but he furthers the “rats from a sinking ship” aesthetic. Except WWE hasn’t started to sink yet. But that bubble could burst if they stumble into bad PR or talent start signing with anybody else because there is no creative incentive to sign with them.

I think it would actually be smart to build around Cole. He’s good, he’s young, he’s professional, he’s got good connections there. It’s a little bit about improving the quality of the product. But it’s also about sending the message that AEW can provide a vision that WWE can’t.

But he’ll probably feud with The Young Bucks because they won’t let him back on BTE or some shit. Ugh.
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Old 08-26-2021, 09:46 AM   #61196
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Adam Cole has grown on me. The best thing about him as an acquisition is that they actually built around him in NXT, and he’s a good worker and talker. A good get objectively, but he furthers the “rats from a sinking ship” aesthetic. Except WWE hasn’t started to sink yet. But that bubble could burst if they stumble into bad PR or talent start signing with anybody else because there is no creative incentive to sign with them.

I think it would actually be smart to build around Cole. He’s good, he’s young, he’s professional, he’s got good connections there. It’s a little bit about improving the quality of the product. But it’s also about sending the message that AEW can provide a vision that WWE can’t.

But he’ll probably feud with The Young Bucks because they won’t let him back on BTE or some shit. Ugh.
That fat ass ain't no Nathan Jones. How many WrestleManias has that bugger appeared on? zilch, that's right. Now go read your books.
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Old 08-26-2021, 11:39 AM   #61197
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cole's head reminds me of a lightbulb
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Old 08-26-2021, 05:55 PM   #61198
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This is the venue Impact is moving to in Vegas, Sam's Town Live
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Old 08-26-2021, 06:12 PM   #61199
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So I heard NWA are doing a show at the Chase in St.Louis this weekend? That sounds amazing.
Last edited by Bad News Gertner; 08-26-2021 at 08:51 PM.
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Old 08-26-2021, 06:20 PM   #61200
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Sounds like Punk bumped the rating about 200,000 as predicted. I wonder how many of those people will stick around though considering that was a fairly vanilla Dynamite.
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