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Old 04-29-2020, 04:59 PM   #55081
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iceman King Gertner View Post
When did they start calling a suicide dive that. I hate "Topa Suicida"
I'd assume at least since the first Cruiserweight Classic tournament so probably somewhere around 2016.
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Old 04-29-2020, 09:45 PM   #55082
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Danny Electric View Post
Plus just looking through the ages of the active wrestlers in WWE (including NXT) and didn’t realise the lack of guys in their 20’s. Also didn’t realise how old Bobby Fish was, they need to start pushing some of the younger talent soon.
This has been the case since like 03
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Old 04-29-2020, 09:47 PM   #55083
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iceman King Gertner View Post
When did they start calling a suicide dive that. I hate "Topa Suicida"
Me too. It's one thing if the guy is a luchador. Like when Rey Fenix does it. But Jesus just say suicide dive. The worstis Excalibur because he uses the same inflection every. Single. Time.

"Topa suiciduuuuuuhhh"
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Old 04-29-2020, 10:35 PM   #55084
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Danny Electric View Post
Plus just looking through the ages of the active wrestlers in WWE (including NXT) and didn’t realise the lack of guys in their 20’s. Also didn’t realise how old Bobby Fish was, they need to start pushing some of the younger talent soon.
They have a bunch of young talent in the PC but majority of them either are too raw or don't come from established indie backgrounds.

Outside of some exceptions, NXT stopped being an effective developmental system years ago and instead became just a place for Triple H and co. to hoard as much notable indie talent as possible.

Even when they do have notable young talent, they don't really do much with them because of the log jam of talent in the company. Austin Theory is only 22 years old but doesn't feel special and is just another guy because of how NXT and RAW has handled him. Deonna Purrazzo is another young talent that could have been a big star for NXT's women division but they did jack shit with her.
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Old 04-30-2020, 01:22 AM   #55085
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emperor Smeat View Post
They have a bunch of young talent in the PC but majority of them either are too raw or don't come from established indie backgrounds.

Outside of some exceptions, NXT stopped being an effective developmental system years ago and instead became just a place for Triple H and co. to hoard as much notable indie talent as possible.

Even when they do have notable young talent, they don't really do much with them because of the log jam of talent in the company. Austin Theory is only 22 years old but doesn't feel special and is just another guy because of how NXT and RAW has handled him. Deonna Purrazzo is another young talent that could have been a big star for NXT's women division but they did jack shit with her.
This is what happens when 1. you have too much talent and/or access to talent because you can pay them so well...and 2. it's even worse if you're so arrogant and/or stupid that you believe you can systematize everything, especially when you believe that you can and should teach and script all your talent to wrestle, promo, etc., the same way and style.

The result is you get a bunch of underdeveloped, bland, no talent, hacks who don't know how to actually do anything except what they're told to do. The especially don't know how to get themselves, their opponents, or their feuds or matches over with anyone with a functioning brain between the ages of 10 to 60 that isn't watching out of sheer habit or boredom.
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Old 04-30-2020, 03:39 AM   #55086
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Old 04-30-2020, 04:56 PM   #55087
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Old 04-30-2020, 05:18 PM   #55088
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He still bears an uncanny resemblance to Little Richard
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Old 04-30-2020, 06:30 PM   #55089
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Old 04-30-2020, 06:37 PM   #55090
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Old 04-30-2020, 06:38 PM   #55091
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Old 04-30-2020, 06:45 PM   #55092
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Seems WWE might be even more worried about a potential coronavirus outbreak happening at their PC due to all the tapings held there the past few weeks.

Enacted new rules that are even more stricter than before in regards to what talent are allowed to do in the building.

Quote:
Originally Posted by WrestlingInc
Regular training at the WWE Performance Center in Orlando, FL has reportedly stopped during the coronavirus pandemic, according to Wrestling Observer Radio.

It was noted that WWE talents who are at the Performance Center for TV tapings are not allowed to use the weight room and gym facilities while they are there. The Performance Center is reportedly shut down for any kind of training right now, according to the report, indicating that other talents who are not there for TV can't just show up to work out as they normally would before the pandemic.

WWE talents that are brought to the Performance Center for tapings are reportedly spending most of their time outside of the building, and aren't hanging out inside. It was noted that talents are only allowed in for their match or segment, or other work, and then must go back out. They are also getting dressed in their gear outside of the normal area.
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Old 04-30-2020, 06:55 PM   #55093
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Learned this today.

A lot of Dan Severn's MMA wins were works. If you look at the names on his record it shows that he defeated Tyson Smith in Winning via tko at an Action Wrestling show.

Tyson Smith is of course Kenny Omega.
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Old 04-30-2020, 07:14 PM   #55094
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I think somebody has been having fun with Wiki again.
Seems like a legitimate mistake but Kenny Omega isn't the Tyson Smith you are talking about.

https://m.sherdog.com/fighter/record/Tyson-Smith-22395

A few people have made this mistake. The real Tyson Smith actually has a lot in common with Kenny Omega because they both fight girls.

https://absolutemixedwrestling.com/pages/tyson-smith
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Old 04-30-2020, 07:19 PM   #55095
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I am doing a deep dive to drag up more info because I am finding claims that Omega says he fought Severn and Fulton.

Maybe the other Tyson Smith that wrestles women is the fraud...

I need to find out the truth.
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Old 04-30-2020, 07:28 PM   #55096
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Hmmm, seems weird for a 160lbs guy to be wrestling women and Severns...
This is a weird coincidence but I think there may even be a third Tyson Smith.

I find it hard to believe Kenny Omega fought between 2005 and 2008 in at least 7 documented mma matches, especially since I can't find any pictures or footage so far.

Reddit says it's true, Wiki agrees but Sherdog ain't saying shit...
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Old 04-30-2020, 07:45 PM   #55097
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I can find more to support the notion than not, but there is no real evidence of it. The MMA profiles match his wiki bio and age so it probably is him.
I'm going to go with it, seems like February 2007 was a wild month.

Kinda pissed that no mma forum has footage of any of this nor any pictures.
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Old 04-30-2020, 08:10 PM   #55098
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seanny One Ball View Post
I think somebody has been having fun with Wiki again.
Seems like a legitimate mistake but Kenny Omega isn't the Tyson Smith you are talking about.

https://m.sherdog.com/fighter/record/Tyson-Smith-22395

A few people have made this mistake. The real Tyson Smith actually has a lot in common with Kenny Omega because they both fight girls.

https://absolutemixedwrestling.com/pages/tyson-smith
I wanted that to be real so bad lol
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Old 04-30-2020, 09:40 PM   #55099
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I honestly think it might be.

I mean Tyson Smith has a few profiles on MMA sites and they all agree he is 36 from Winnipeg except that fucking weird one that wrestles women for cash. He is Canadian though...

It's infuriating because there isn't one picture of any of the events he fought on.
I literally went through a comprehensive list of Kenny Omega wrestling matches and cross checked the dates with the MMA matches just to see if he was busy elsewhere on any of those dates.
He wasn't.

It could be a mad coincidence or it could be true.

I kinda want it to be true now.
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Old 04-30-2020, 09:43 PM   #55100
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Dude fought four times in February 2007 and twice in April 2007.
Two matches on two separate nights too.

This is the weirdest MMA record I have seen for ages.
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Old 04-30-2020, 09:49 PM   #55101
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Apparently one of the ideas for the end of the Vince McMahon's illegitimate son angle involved Vince killing Hornswoggle by chucking him off a bridge.
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Old 04-30-2020, 09:50 PM   #55102
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In a pillowcase no less
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Old 04-30-2020, 09:51 PM   #55103
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Drown him in a Dixie cup
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Old 05-01-2020, 12:17 AM   #55104
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Roll him up in a carpet and throw him off a bridge!

Tee hee hee
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Old 05-01-2020, 01:50 AM   #55105
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The Rock about to layeth the smacketh down on WWE's ratings for their RAW empty arena shows.

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Originally Posted by Observer Newsletter
There is no way this can make Vince McMahon happy. NBC will be airing Titan Games, the reality show Dwayne Johnson is producing, on Monday nights from 8-9 p.m. starting 5/25. The first episode will air from 8-10 p.m. as the season premiere. The first season averaged six million viewers. The show was not scheduled to run this early but with the absence of sports on television, NBC moved up its air date. Besides Johnson, former WWE head Raw writer Brian Gewirtz is an executive producer of the show
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Old 05-01-2020, 07:17 AM   #55106
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Originally Posted by Seanny One Ball View Post
I honestly think it might be.

I mean Tyson Smith has a few profiles on MMA sites and they all agree he is 36 from Winnipeg except that fucking weird one that wrestles women for cash. He is Canadian though...

It's infuriating because there isn't one picture of any of the events he fought on.
I literally went through a comprehensive list of Kenny Omega wrestling matches and cross checked the dates with the MMA matches just to see if he was busy elsewhere on any of those dates.
He wasn't.

It could be a mad coincidence or it could be true.

I kinda want it to be true now.
It happened on a pro wrestling card so it very well could be
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Old 05-01-2020, 09:50 AM   #55107
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I've checked that card on a couple of sites and it only records two MMA matches on the show, no mention of any wrestling besides in the promotion name. So weird.

This is where you were spot on about Severn in the first place, he fought on suspiciously tiny shows that were filled with untrained fighters and taking a dive for $50 against a legend beats having your arm ripped off.

This is why Cornette and others think MMA is basically pro wrestling all over again.
It's hard to argue when you look at a carny show.
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Old 05-01-2020, 09:52 AM   #55108
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Lol he fought Shannon Rich in back to back matches and did the same exact finish. One march was in like Alaska and the other was somewhere down south in like California so they didn't think anyone would notice.
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Old 05-01-2020, 09:59 AM   #55109
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Shannon Ritch, Travis Fulton, Dan Severn... Anyone that fights unheard-of's on a weekly basis will have a whole lot of suspicious data in their record.

I might waste my day doing that actually.
Statistical analysis...
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Old 05-01-2020, 10:06 AM   #55110
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My favourite worked MMA fight is Takada vs Kyle Sturgeon where Sturgeon drops Takada right away with a kick and just stands there. Probably because the Yakuza were sharpening their knives in the front row.
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Old 05-01-2020, 10:10 AM   #55111
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Mark Coleman fixed a few when he was broke, always in Japan.
Pancrase and Pride had a lot of fixed fights obviously but people forget guys like Ken and Frank Shamrock did it too. Vernon White was pretty notorious for it.

Pretty much all Kimbo fights were fixed. Dive money.

The Japs perfected that formula for everyone to enjoy. Buy off one guy, let the other think the win was real.
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Old 05-01-2020, 10:18 AM   #55112
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Dada5000
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Old 05-01-2020, 10:53 AM   #55113
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Quote:
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I

This is why Cornette and others think MMA is basically pro wrestling all over again.
It's hard to argue when you look at a carny show.
If this was the case wouldn't UFC be a lot better? Sure it may have happened in the company before but I have no proof. Could've been a ton of reasons for a fight to get thrown. They don't all have to do with the promotion itself though. I don't think that UFC or Bellator are inherently worked beyond match making being strategic.
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Old 05-01-2020, 11:36 AM   #55114
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I said MMA, not UFC.
However UFC has had plenty of fixed fights, right from day 1.
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Old 05-01-2020, 07:36 PM   #55115
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Old 05-01-2020, 08:18 PM   #55116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seanny One Ball View Post
Mark Coleman fixed a few when he was broke, always in Japan.
Pancrase and Pride had a lot of fixed fights obviously but people forget guys like Ken and Frank Shamrock did it too. Vernon White was pretty notorious for it.

Pretty much all Kimbo fights were fixed. Dive money.

The Japs perfected that formula for everyone to enjoy. Buy off one guy, let the other think the win was real.
Didn't Ken Shamrock vs. Rich Franklin in UFC's first Ultimate Finale have a phantom punch in it? Also, it had Ken Shamrock take off his cup in the middle of the cage after the fight.
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Old 05-01-2020, 09:34 PM   #55117
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That's the beauty of MMA, it's hard to tell if someone is acting weird because they have given up or because they are outclassed.
Ken Shamrock worked a good number of fights early on and I have no problem believing that some of his later fights were extremely questionable given the level of opponent he was facing. I think when it comes to the UFC he was likely, at worst, guilty of fighting when he had to know he was going to lose pretty badly so his fights against Ortiz and Franklin were only feasible on paper.
I think Dana White used his name value to boost a couple of people who would have done well without it, which he is continually guilty of to this day.

Dana rigs things in people's favour but I'm not sure he has outright paid a guy to take a dive. I think referees, judges and fighters have been influenced in all of the most traditional ways though.

Maybe a ref stops getting used as much or has various rules emphasised to them before the match or an unsuited fighter takes a fight on short notice for a guaranteed 3 fight contract after.

Dana White is like a horrible mixture of Vince and every boxing promoter ever but like they were, he's smarter than the carnies so the fixing is all much smarter.

Small-time logic would be "It's easier to pay a guy to lose than pay a guy to win" but that's why the worst fixes are so obvious.
If you want to make it hard to spot you buy the entire business that the refs, judges and athletes compete in.
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Old 05-01-2020, 09:46 PM   #55118
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Up til Zuffa bought UFC the fixing was pretty brutal and often quite obvious. Guys on the same team might agree beforehand who was getting the rub based on likelihood of overall winning. I know Mark Hall did that for someone.

The worst I can remember off the top of my head was Anthony Macias vs Oleg Taktarov. He just runs into a guillotine and taps straight away. I think even Jim Brown realises it's fake and says something.

God Bless those early ones. Al Snow was in Dan Severns corner for one of them.
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Old 05-02-2020, 01:47 AM   #55119
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Quote:
Florida Governor, Ron DeSantis announced at a COVID-19 briefing that sporting events such as WWE and AEW's weekly shows, fans are allowed into the building as long as the venue is at a maximum of 25% capacity.


The guidelines mandate that this can start as early as next Monday night, with Monday Night RAW, from the Performance Center in Orlando, Florida.

AEW is also taping all of their events at Daily's Place in Jacksonville, Florida.

This is huge news and also means that AEW can allow fans into the arena for their big Double or Nothing PPV, May 23rd.
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Old 05-02-2020, 09:25 AM   #55120
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Up til Zuffa bought UFC the fixing was pretty brutal and often quite obvious. Guys on the same team might agree beforehand who was getting the rub based on likelihood of overall winning. I know Mark Hall did that for someone.

The worst I can remember off the top of my head was Anthony Macias vs Oleg Taktarov. He just runs into a guillotine and taps straight away. I think even Jim Brown realises it's fake and says something.

God Bless those early ones. Al Snow was in Dan Severns corner for one of them.
Just watched the match you referenced. Holy fake shit Batman. Never, even if someone were a "brawler" rush in head first like that....... dumbest thing to do.
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